When The Doors Close

So many the things that have been said here tonight, especially by elp6n, demonstrate perfectly why consolidation is bad for kids from the smaller towns.

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What do the residents of Pound have to show for their tax dollars? Pound has Foodland, The Dollar General, a carwash, a broken down footbridge, and a park that consists of a single small prefab play gym. They use the the old Christopher Gist High School as a town hall. I would prefer to see it used in a more academic sense (maybe even alongside the tow hall functions). A museum perhaps, education center, etc. But no. A town hall is all it is. There's no funding or desire to do more with it. Not a great sense of community there.

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Here's an example. Is this the kind of garbage that kids from Pound are going to hear every day if they are consolidated with Wise?

Talk about the annhialation of a community.. imagine youre from Pound. Your kid goes to school every day and is looked down on by some self-righteous idiot from Wise who thinks that because Wise has a college and a few businesses than their town is obviously superior to Pound, and that your kid should be ashamed to live there, and should want to move to Wise where things are "bigger and better.."

What utter rubbish. And don't say that stuff would not happen.. because if adults in Wise are capable of it, the kids will be even worse.

I absolutely agree with you Aphrodite4ever. I don't think that I could have said that any better myself. I love living here and I love Pound. Pound is my home and it always will be. Yes, we are small, but we are a tight-knit community and that's what I like about it. The schools are the the only good thing that Pound has left these days. By taking away our school, you are killing what's left of our little town. Instead of killing our community, why not try and build it back up. If people would put in the time and effort, they can build up these small communities around here instead of trying to take away what's left and make them ghost towns. To me, there is so many things wrong with consolidation that I don't know where to begin. But I refuse to roll over and let someone take away the only thing our small community has left.

Guess what?

Wise is superior to Pound.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...44/Popcorn.jpg

Things like this could be mentally detrimental to the students from the smaller communities and possible the communities themselves. Kids would grow up thinking if I stay here, then Im nothing but trash, when this is NOT true. When a kid hears that kind of trash everyday they begin to believe it. The they would move away from the area as soon as they had the chance and it would cripple our town even more than what it is now.

...idiot.

Since when? Just because you think you are doesnt make you superior. This is exactly the kind of trash our kids would be exposed to every day if we were to consolidate.

Businesses. But that is that.
And that was why? Wal-Mart. Which was already where?
And that is only because of the land and the College.
The only economic plan our great economic board has come up with.
And it wasn't their idea it was the person who developed the land. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
Oh yeah we have a four year college. And it has a football team.
Should we all go ape [censored] and act like it's all about spirit. And saving the community.
Never move the college or touch it. I went there. Oh my gosh could they think of that. Would they? Oh no.
What was the cheer for the CAVS or UVA. Or ok UVA@Wise. Let's be correct and politically correct at that. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
And yeah a little sarcasim.
I'm a tad bit pissed by a few attitudes. So i guess im venting before i go to sleep. I'd rather it be off my mind so i can have my usual good 8.

Is that Coeburn or Rye Cove. And honestly no sarcasim. You take some great pics. I have always said that. Great pics.

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Since when? Just because you think you are doesnt make you superior.

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Let's see. Wise has many businesses. Pound is about like Jenkins, but with somewhat better roads.

The only reason Pound is more than a wide spot in the road is because of it's location in relation to 23 and 83. Does a town of 1000 people need a small school all to itself?

If Wise Co. was like Scott Co., meaning that it was pretty devoid of major roads, then I could see a reason to oppose consolidation.

But Wise Co. has great roads. So what if a kid has to ride a bus for 30 minutes? I went to school with kids who rode the bus for almost an hour morning and evening. Gives them time to sleep, do homework, or make out with their sweetie pie.

As for tax money staying with a locality, where do you think the majority of the funds for schools come from? The state. Like it or not, the eastern half of VA does a lot to finance the schools on this end of the state. If they had the same attitude as some here, schools on this end of the state would still be one room with a school marm.

Let's look at town populations for a moment. All taken from the 2000 census.

Big Stone Gap - 4856
Wise - 3255
Coeburn - 1996
Appalachia - 1839
Pound - 1009
St Paul - 1000

Two small towns less than 15 miles from the nearest town. Each of those nearest towns with at least twice the population. Then you've got Appy. Just two miles away from BSG, yet there are two schools. If any consolidation makes sense, it is Appy and PV.

Wise Co's population continues to drop and with that it makes less and less sense to operate 6 high schools in such a developed county. The only barrier is the thinking of those who refuse to let go of some inane mascot/school identity.

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Is that Coeburn or Rye Cove. And honestly no sarcasim. You take some great pics. I have always said that. Great pics.

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Not my work. One of the many funny photos I have saved to a folder for situations just like this.

Have you been on some of the road in Wise Co.?

Sandy Ridge alone is a nightmare. And some God awful place called Beans Gap or something like that. Barely could get two vehicles in some areas of that place.
I almost got sick with all the winding roads and quick stops.
Then of all things a school bus. Going to pick up students to bring back to the area?

I am for consolidation if done right. But don't compare it to a few level areas.

And i do know you mean well. And i think you do know the area i am talking. I would never take a bus to some of that area.

I've lived here almost my whole life and never knew some of these place existed.

Never again will i question a snow schedule or a snow day. That was experience enough. And more than let me know why we don't have school on those days.

You made a very good point LPDFTBL. The people raised up in these small communities like Pound, possess a certain sense of pride and respect that these "city people" obviously don't have. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] Being raised in a small town in the country is not such a horrible thing like people make it out to be. It doesn't consist of a bunch of inbred hillbillies like it's perceived to be. We are a laid back group of individuals who have been raised with morals and values that most people this day in time don't possess. People from around here respect others and don't judge them based on outward appearances. However, like in this situation, you insult us and we will fight back. This all goes back to us having pride for our community.

Just so you know Pound used to have more businesses than wise did, it has only recently changed. And again you assume that we want a big school and we DO NOT!

As for the longer bus rides, the kids should have slept and done homework the night before, and a school bus is no place for CHILDREN to be making out. If things like that are a common occurance now adays, then it is no wonder our world is in such a pitiful state.

I am glad that we do get funding, but my point is let us keep OUR coal severance tax. Dont send it to these [censored] out in wise and BSG that will only use it for OUR destruction.

I wish you idiot would make up your minds about whether our county was develope or not, I keep hearing that we're backwards, but then we're developed. Give me a break, that fumble is way to easy to go after.

We are not clinging to a mascot or whatever you want to call it, we are also hanging onto our pride. We have pride in our schools, our students, and our communities, and if you are too blind to see that then you do not need to be here.

You should try some of the roads on South fork, they are nightmares too, if you hit one of the holes you're liable to loose your vehicle, yet buses drive over them every day. Actually I cannot remember the last time that they were paved.

Is Sandy Ridge bad? Of course. I hate driving up there during the middle of summer, much less in the middle of winter.

But Scott Co. is the same way. Ever heard of Dean Hollow? Little Duck? [censored]'s Neck (not near BSG)? Chestnut Ridge? Corn Ridge?

Hell, over half (and I'm just throwing a number out there, might be more, might be less) of Scott Co's roads are still graveled. Yet Scott only has 3 high schools. I knew kids who rode a bus from darn near RCHS all the way to TSHS.

Every county around here has narrow and winding roads. I would even put 72 between Dungannon and Coeburn against Sandy Ridge Rd.

I know those in Appy, Pound, (and to a lesser extent) St Paul want to keep their identity and school. I'm sure those in Dungannon and Nickelsville felt the same way in the late 60s. Or those in Jonesville, Pennington, Dryden, and Keokee in the late 80s.

But as I see it there just isn't any way to keep all these high schools open. Granted I'm looking from the outside in as I have no children in Wise Co. schools and most likely never will. And I think that detachment gives me a unique perspective. I've been in every high school in the county save Pound and I've yet to see a school in good shape. Twin Springs High School is almost 40 years old and is still in pretty good shape. SCSS has done a good job of maintenance with that school.

Would it be good if all of the WCHS's could be remodeled? Yes. But some of these schools were built what, 60 or 70 years ago? Before computers, before televison, before air conditioners. One must compare what it will cost to remodel the schools versus what it will cost to build one or two or three new schools that, with proper care, will last into the 22nd century.

Perhaps I am too single-minded, but I tend to look at things like this solely from a financial point-of-view.

I dont think you will ever understand because it is not something that threatens your way of life and probably never will. IMHO it would cost about the same to renovate the 6 schools we've already go than to start from scratch. The buildings we have now are perfectly good, they are stronger, sturdier, and safer than what you would have built today. These buildings were built when people took pride in their craftsmanship, not just how big their wallet was going to become for doing it. Like I said earlier, if we were talking about an 50-60 old college or university building here, there would be no questions about it, it would be renovated. Why is it different for a highschool? It makes no sense. And if you dont mind me asking, if you're "looking from the outside" and have no children in the school system, then what concern is it of yours?

When Wise and Dickenson counties do consolidate, our Grandchildren will be the ones who benefit. elp6n will be superintendent and NotSoSilentBob will be head guidance counselor!!!!!!!!!!!!! [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Maybe in an acid dream

Is an aphrodite close kin to a morphadite???????????? [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

last time I checked Aphrodite was the Greek goddess of love. Think you might need to brush up on your history a little.

Just joking you wittle wildcat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/getsmile.tmp008106164.gif[/img]

okay just makin sure. Sometimes on here you cant be sure who's jokin and who's serious.

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Does a town of 1000 people need a small school all to itself?

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Yes. Any school over 400 kids is too big IMO. Also, your figures are flawed. These "towns" consist of more people than just that number that lives within the town limits. Your figures only speak for the inside of the town, not for all of the outlying areas that are still part of the community and the school service district.

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But Wise Co. has great roads. So what if a kid has to ride a bus for 30 minutes? I went to school with kids who rode the bus for almost an hour morning and evening. Gives them time to sleep, do homework, or make out with their sweetie pie.

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Do homework on a bus? Yeah right. Make out? Hah. Also, if you started a bus at the Kentucky state line in Flat Gap and had to drive all the way to JJ Kelly picking up kids as you went, it could easily take an hour and 30 minutes. Someone said 45 minutes earlier, but thats how long it takes driving normal speed in a car not making any stops.

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schools on this end of the state would still be one room with a school marm.

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Not such a bad idea.

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If any consolidation makes sense, it is Appy and PV.

[/ QUOTE ] Big Stone Gap and Appalachia are two distinct communities with their own different identities. It is very similar to the Pound-Wise situation discussed earlier, the Appy kids would be lorded over by the BSG kids.

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Hell, over half (and I'm just throwing a number out there, might be more, might be less) of Scott Co's roads are still graveled. Yet Scott only has 3 high schools. I knew kids who rode a bus from darn near RCHS all the way to TSHS.

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Scott County is far more sparsely populated than Wise County is.. this accounts for the lesser number of schools and the greater areas served by those schools.

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I've been in every high school in the county save Pound and I've yet to see a school in good shape.

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Just what does a school have to be to be in "good shape"? That's ridiculous. You cant expect them all to look like they were built yesterday, people use them you know.

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Perhaps I am too single-minded, but I tend to look at things like this solely from a financial point-of-view.


[/ QUOTE ] Yes that is a problem. Because this whole thing should be about what is best for the students and the communities, not about someones pocketbook.

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Would it be good if all of the WCHS's could be remodeled? Yes. But some of these schools were built what, 60 or 70 years ago? Before computers, before televison, before air conditioners. One must compare what it will cost to remodel the schools versus what it will cost to build one or two or three new schools that, with proper care, will last into the 22nd century.


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Here's the best one of all... if we build a school today thats supposed to last into the 22nd century.. then guess what? That building would have to stand and be used for over 90 years!

Now.. there is something fundamentally wrong with that statement. If were going to build a building and use it for 90+ years, then why cant we use our existing buildings for 90+ years? This is a non-sequitur.

We all know that in 50 years, just like today, someone would be yammering about how old the school was and that we needed a new one. Again...

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are duplicates of courses being offered at local colleges and they should be properly taught at those colleges

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Why wait to take these classes? This is detrimental to students. Also, very few students have the ability to dual-enroll. This takes tuition. AP courses are part of a public education. And those that do dual-enroll still dont get in one or two semesters the AP courses that should be offered in high school. AP course boost attractiveness to colleges - boost scholarship opportunities.

Our students are not marketable. Our students are not competitive. When students apply for college admission they are compared to the other applicants. Our students can't compete with regards to college prep. This affects their financial aid (scholarships) also.

http://www.virginia.edu/undergradadm...admission.html
http://www.admissions.duke.edu/jump/applying/who.asp
http://www.admiss.vt.edu/apply/fresh...e_look_for.php
http://www.admissions.unc.edu/applying/freshman.htm
Just some example of what colleges are looking for.

You may not agree with the efficacy, but the reality is these courses are weighted heavily in admissions consideration. The colleges dont care why a student doesn't have more AP classes. The colleges only care that you do have them at all.

Yes the "basic" education at Pound is good. But why stick our students with basic? Give these kids options. Don't give them a basic education. Give them an outstanding education. They're being left behind simply because they live in Southwest VA.

As it stands right now, if I had a high school age student in Wise County he/she would be yanked for homeschooling/private schooling or moved to a better school system. I would be doing my child a disservice by not giving him/her every academic option available.

If my options are "sense of community" or "child with a future" I pick child with a future.

[/ QUOTE ] I don't have time to read the whole thread, but there is no tuition for dual enrollment. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Move the AP classes to college, what is different from that and the "one big high school" you want? Taking them your jr and sr year under dual enrollment is no different, saves space, teachers and cash. And not one of those classes would be taught in Appy or Pound. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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take uva wise out of the county and you would have a four lane county wide on our way to bristol and kingsport.

I say that because I see so many people copy and past stuff on here, then lean on it as if they made some large find, other than knowing how to use a search engine.

[/ QUOTE ] It is the only way we can get some of you to read. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

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Just because I am not an ancient decrepit person such as yourself

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I just love hearing comments like this. Those who say these things are so naive & immature. "I'm never going to get old I'll be 19 playing house forever." And then before you know it, maybe before you've even hit 25, you've got 4 kids hanging off your ankles, not working, drawing a check. (Fortunately I've had the good sense to avoid that but so many of my Pound High School classmates with the same attitude couldn't.)
It'a amusing. At the ripe old age of 30 I'm decrepit. Your time's coming young lady. You too will soon be ancient & decrepit in 11 short years.

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last time I checked Aphrodite was the Greek goddess of love. Think you might need to brush up on your history a little

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Mythology = Fiction. History = Non-Fiction. Aphrodite = Fiction. It would be pointless for him to brush up on his history to learn about mythological characters. Did you take AP Mythology and fail?

X~Lone~Crusader~X. I dont live in Wise (never have) and I didn't go to school in Wise. While it's none of your business where I live, I will say that most of my family still lives in Pound, and they have been in Pound since well before Pound became Pound (Bold Camp to be exact - sound familiar?). Odds are, we're even related. Isn't that nice.
Pound is my hometown.

You say "we don't care what you think." That my apply to the two of you, but my family, friends, and former educators (which in reality is a large portion of Pound) seem to care what my opinions are - I can have intelligent conversations with them.

I'm sorry I didn't mention the big ol' pizza plus and The Pixie in town. Wow! The economy has exploded! Such progress! Do you even know how many times the Pixie has opened and closed over the years? It's a roach breeding center. You're too young to even remember the fight to bring in a few nationally recognized chains. It's still ongoing. The town of Pound hates change & progress. Pizza Plus hardly counts as progress. I note you didn't counter on the fact that Pound is refusing to attempt recruiting industry/jobs/a future for the town. You can't deny it. Pound has nothing to offer for business & industry.

As far as having "too much time" I work 3 jobs seven days a week, 1 full time 2 part time. I get no days off no time off. I work to make something of myself and to earn the things I want in life (you know... 'the old fashioned way'). If I want to browse the internet in my free 10 hours a week then by hell I will. What do you people do? Hardee's? WalMart? Romas? A little part time coursework at the local Community College?

I stumbled upon the myspace material accidentally when I was sent something to review by someone else. I dont even have a myspace account myself - no time for it. But while I was there I recognized some usernames and checked it out. Spelling & grammar: atrocious. Dont get on here and argue that your education was great and then demonstrate the opposite by not even being able to conjugate verbs.

I could rebut every single comment made on there. Some of these comments made during the night are the most infantile unintelligent things I've heard in a long time, and in a way defend consolidation and better education.
I made my point and my opinion will not change

And who on here from Wise or BSG is saying they're better than the folks from Pound & Appy? I'm from Pound and I sure dont think that. I would laugh my rear off at any Wise person who dared approach me and claim superiority. You must be the one with the confidence issue.

Consolidation will happen. I'm not worried about it.

LPDFTBL.. [ QUOTE ]
But you don't win folks by making them feel inferior. Or as if your talking down to them

[/ QUOTE ] I'm sorry if my words are too big for you and that properly structured sentences befuddle you. I'm not going to dumb down my manner of speech. My parents and other family are working folks too. Blue Collar. Wage earners. They dont seem to think I'm talking down to them and I use the same manner of speech with them all. It's very sad that you think speaking thoughts clearly is acting stuck up.

You take whatever opportunity you can to stab at me because you're a misogynist. I figured that out a long time ago. I know you have a personal issue with me... but you can take it up with me to my face. Dont hide behind that monitor.

I took some of my free time last night and made my point on the matter, but my time is more valuable than this post (remember those 3 jobs?). I wont be wasting anymore time on it: I've got more important things to do with my time - like work. I have no doubt some will come on and continue to argue, maybe quote a few things I said & attempt to rebut. Enjoy yourselves.

When it's all said and done this forum has no standing in the actual consolidation issue.

Wasting your time arguing with these people. God knows that straight facts scare the hell out of these folks. Hey, if I was 19 just got out of school, I would probably fight it, not having children, not swallowing my pride, but I am not. I have a couple of folks more important to think about than me. Folks that are live in this little area of the world don't know any better. They like the simple, slow (and limited) life. I love this area and its people, but pride goeth before a fall.
Folks we can argue about it forever and nothing is going to change a thing. You all can park your little VW in front of the train, wave your little flags of protest, and watch it flatten you. Things change, times change. Either accept it or live in your little fantasy world and deal with serious disappointment.

i'd say in five years from now that person won't even be living in wise county....they will move away for better opportunities.

I agree with you and elp6n I rember when this stuff came up during the bashum mess I just finally got tired of arguing there are some people who's minds you can never change and I have gotten to the point that I don't even try.....

One of my favorite lines in this thread was that ANY school with 400 students was too large I did a boat load of digging when DC was looking at consolidation and while all reports will point to smaller schools being a better learning environment the studies consider 700 kids in 10-12 a small school and one study even stated that once a school drops below 300 in 10-12 that school in general starts losing programs based on censes. I did not keep my old links but I am sure anyone who wants to can Google and find much of the same info (If I am feeling froggy later I may do it myself LOL)

In any case I DO feel that consolidation would be beneficial to MOST SWVA schools but I also feel that if the backlash now is as strong as it was last year in Wise Co. it will take schools losing programs to get any type of change.

Sixty to eighty million dollars for renovations????????? Lee High cost 12 million dollars, and has room for 1200 students. Maybe Lee County got it right a long time ago, and our travel problems in athletics isn't so much that we made a mistake as much as we are years ahead of the rest of the counties around us in doing what must be done. I know I'm going to be blasted for saying that by all of you critics of consolidation and critics of Lee County, but I'll say it again: Lee High cost 12 million, and you are looking at spending sixty million to renovate 50 year old buildings. Maybe you should have consolidated back when two by fours were a dollar each.

Were it not for the fact that I have joint custody of my sons, and they love it here, I would be gone. I would still visit, but jobs that pay 2-3 times more are available all over the country.
An example: I work at the only Level 6 prison in the state. Red Onion is considered to be one of if not the most dangerous prisons in the United States. The starting pay for a Corrections Officer is 25,600 right now. I have a friend employed at a Level 1 facility in Pennsylvania (equivelent to Camp 18, a minumum security field unit). His starting salary at hire was 32,800. The cost of living in his area is comparable to ours. Now, 25K may seem like good pay here in this area, but for what we deal with, not really. It's just that folks know that jobs are thin here. If you want to make a living you pretty much have the mines and the prison here in SWVA.

If it isn't good enough for you around here anymore, you and the little princess move. She is very intelligent and you seem to have a lot of fire, so if you can better yourself and the standards of your family, I say go for it. And don't let the door hit ya on the way out. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Can you not read? I gave the reason why we are still here. Are you content with the living that your kids will make if they choose to stay strapped down here? Why do you think so many of these youngsters leave after High School? They want to make a good living, and their parents, while sad to see them move, understand. While we were at the Appalachia High reunion a few weeks back ago, we got to reading the name tags of folks, and over 3/4 of these people no longer lived in Appalachia. They saw it.

And Counts, I don't think cosolidation would of helped your schooling one iota!!!!!!!!!! [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Yes, I can read, but all you and Elissa do is [censored] and complain about the standards in our areas. And if you move somewhere else let us know if it is cheaper or comparable to live. I bet a dollar against a snickers bar that we live in one of the most cost friendly areas in the country.

We live in one of the lowest paying areas in the U.S. You really need to step out of this area a bit and see what folks are paying in other areas. I've seen folks making more at Taco Bell in other areas than we pay our police officers here. One of these days you will grow up and drop this silly grudge you have with us (once you figure out that we don't give a flying [censored] about what you think)
They'll be no moving out (unless I get full custody) but if a series of events allow me to, I'll post pics of my paystubs away from here [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/beer1.gif[/img]

I could care less about your relationship, just know more about it than most. I hope you succeed and have a very happy life. I just don't think your better half should put down 18-20 years olds points of views, when she is not a whole lot older herself.

We are in one of the lowest paying regions of the U.S., that's very true. Indian Dad has his kids here and I don't think anyone can argue why he wants to stay in the area.

Where are you working up there in Clintwood currently, Burrhead? What's the job market like up in Dickenson County nowadays?

You know where I'm working! But I could make a phone call and have a job in less than an hour. Job market is greattttttttt [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

I can't help but laugh at you and feel sorry for you at the same time. Yeah, i'd say you do know a little about our relationship, seeing as you were PMing every friend of mine, and folks who know us in your lil obsession with us. I could care less who knows what about us, as long as they get the whole story, not yours and the ex's [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/007.gif[/img]

You are a 8 yr-old trapped in a 50 yr-old's body. You shoot your mouth out of left field, then go into Charlie Brown (why is everybody always picking on me ) mode when folks remind you that you have well earned the right to be tabbed one of the most disliked posters on this forum. You bring so much on yourself. When will you ever learn? Never I'd wager. Heck, even the folks from Clintwood (except for family who has to love you) can't tolerate you. I know I have my share of enemies, but at least most of the folks from my town like me [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
Can I get a witness from the congregation?